22:59 < _maxi> hi there :-)
23:00 < venka> hi all
23:00 < venka> we wait for nick?
23:00 < jmckenna> hello :)
23:01 < djay> hello, I think that nick won't be able to join us toda
23:01 < djay> venka: does Hayashi-san planed to come ?23:02  * jmckenna finds wiki page in email: http://www.zoo-project.org/trac/wiki/PSC/meetings/PSCMeet11
23:02 < venka> No idea. We have quorum, so we can start the meeting.
23:02 < djay> quorum is 5 I think
23:02 < venka> yes we are 5.
23:03 < venka> maxi, jeff, dkastl, Gerald and Venka.
23:03 < djay> oups sorry you're right. Nice
23:04 < venka> Who will chair todays meeting?
23:04 -!- Irssi: #zoo-project: Total of 9 nicks [1 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 8 normal]
23:04 < djay> I can propose to chair ... :)
23:04 < venka> Jeff, can you chair?
23:05 < venka> oops. fine. Gerald, thanks.
23:05 < venka> so we start.
23:05 < jmckenna> what does a chair of irc meeting do?  how about we just move through the agenda? :)
23:05 < djay> so ZOO 1.2.0 release
23:05 < venka> Agenda 1) About ZOO-1.2.0
23:06 < _maxi> ok, 1.1) Zoo/GRASS what is its status?
23:06 < venka> (Gerald will chair todays meeting)
23:06 < djay> great
23:06 < djay> so ZOO is working like a charm with GRASS for both raster and vector 
23:07 < venka> That is great.
23:07 < jmckenna> what platforms has that been tested on?
23:08 < djay> Markus, Soeren and I setup a demo ZOO-Kernel running on zoo-project.org and providing access to GRASS Services
23:08 < djay> Markus first setup GRASS7 on zoo-project.org during the last PSC meeting
23:08 < venka> GNU/Linux platform, I think.
23:08 < jmckenna> ok great.  i guess more testing should be done at some point.
23:09 < djay> Then I've tun some tests and provide many feedback to Soeren about some issue about the way used to write zcfg files (some informations was missing)
23:09 < djay> jmckenna: zoo-project.org server is a GNU/Linux platform
23:09 < jmckenna> what is the link to the client-side demo showing zoo with grass?
23:09 < djay> you're right I forgot to specify
23:10 < djay> the link to the client-side demo is the result of the work we made with Soeren to modify some bahavior in the QGIS WPS Client to make it working
23:10 < venka> http://www.zoo-project.org/trac/wiki/ZooWebSite/QGIS_WPS_Client
23:10 < jmckenna> cool thanks venka
23:10 < djay> jmckenna: I suppose that you're speaking about the page just quoted by venka, right ?  
23:11 < djay> gasp ok you just need the link :)
23:11 < venka> we are inching closer to 1.2.0 and i think more testing can be done by releasing rc1
23:11 < jmckenna> oh i meant a web client leveraging zoo with grass.  i will read that page more
23:12 < djay> thanks to the work we made on the QGIS WPS Client a new 0.5.0 version came out some times ago and is working with ZOO-Kernel
23:12 < djay> I want to insist on the fact that the QGIS WPS Client is still "buggy" in some options you can or cannot set.
23:13 < djay> Unfortunatly I won't help more on this work during the upcoming month. I won't get enough time...
23:13 < _maxi>  is it out of the box the integration? I mean, what step you need to install the link zoo-grass?
23:14 < venka> udig also has a wps plugin, i think. what about the openlayers wps clients?
23:14 < venka> these can be tested after we release 1.2.0rc1
23:14 < djay> for instance from the QGIS WPS Client you cannot setup the input mimeType, so you have ot define the default format to a format supported by the WPS Client (mainly GML, some geojson was implemented but for text/plain mimeType, we shouldn't have to define specific default format and the client interface should provide us a select list to choose by ourself)
23:16 < jmckenna> the QGIS WPS client just accepts a URL to ZOO services, parses the capabilities, and then displays what grass functions are available?
23:16 < djay> _maxi: yes, until you get an installation of GRASS7 and the WPS-GRASS-Bridge yo ucan easily deploy your service
23:16 < djay> jmckenna: watch the video 
23:16 < jmckenna> roger :)
23:16 < djay> I invite everybody to watch the video
23:16 < _maxi> yes, i will
23:17 < venka> video is impressive. GRASS commands can be run remotely.
23:17 < djay> to see that indeed the QGIS WPS Client display capabilities, in describeProcess *strangely* it uses the Abstract value as an url to display GRASS documentation page 
23:17 < djay> (note I said strangely as Abstract is not specifically an url :) )
23:18 < djay> anyway
23:18 < djay> you can use this url from you QGIS WPS Client if you want to test the GRASS Services :
23:18 < djay> http://zoo-project.org/cgi-grass/zoo_loader.cgi
23:18 < venka> we will have to wait for someone to fix QGIS issues and also for volunteer help to test with other wps clients.
23:19 < jmckenna> awesome...imagine removing the need for the GIS, in your browser alone.  maxi this is like your work years ago in php and grass :)
23:19 < djay> I also use this setup to test the CGAL Voronoi service, which I invite you to test with your data, just to check the speed :) 
23:19 < djay> venka: about testing
23:19 < venka> ye, about testing.
23:19 < venka> ?
23:20 < djay> I spoke a lot some weeks ago with Nick about automatic testing, something like a make test which can help us to debug and manage the source code in a beter way
23:20 < djay> I think we have to implement a way to automaticaly test a ZOO-Project setup
23:20 < venka> Gerald: you mean ZOO-Kernel testing
23:20 < djay> mmm this is one of the issue we spoken about, indeed I spoke about ZOO-Kernel
23:21 < djay> but as I said ZOO-Prject it is because there is also ZOO-Services
23:21 < djay> and ZOO-API
23:21 < djay> if ZOO-API was installed obviously
23:21 < _maxi> jeff: yes, but much more powerful :-)
23:22 < jmckenna> _maxi: yes, cool!  you were ahead of your time hahaha
23:22 < _maxi> please accept my compliments for the work done so far..
23:22 < _maxi> video is impressive
23:22 < venka> (GRASSLinks Linux port since 1996)
23:23 < _maxi> yes it is..
23:23 < venka> (Linux port was done by us at OCU)
23:23 < jmckenna> small world :)  now zoo makes things even easier
23:24 < _maxi> what about java and jscript?
23:24 < djay> Java was enhanced
23:24 < venka> WE can focus on further testing bth manual and automatic after rc1 is released. Hope all agree.
23:24 < djay> when saying enhanced I mean, we just correct the desactivation of the JIT compiler 
23:25 < djay> (nick is on phone with me, he say he will join in 10 minutes)
23:25 < jmckenna> +1 for further testing needed
23:25 < djay> +1
23:25 < _maxi> +1
23:25 < dkastl> +1 for actually making a RC (or something similar)
23:25 < djay> nick say -1
23:25 < djay> :)
23:26 < venka> +1 for testing after 1.2rc1 or 1.2beta is released.
23:26 < venka> Can nick give some reason for his -1.
23:27 < djay> Javascript was bit enhanced, ZOO-Kernel is now loading automatically the zoo-api.js and proj4.js if present in the same directory than your ZOO-Kernel
23:27 < jmckenna> (beta is first, one it passes community testing, we release RC1, once that passes testing PSC would propose RC1 becomes 1.2 release)
23:27 < djay> before you was forced to copy/paste the content of the zoo-api.js and proj4.js in your js service provider code 
23:28 < djay> reluc make work on ZOO-API Documentation
23:28 < _maxi> cool
23:28 < jmckenna> rc sounds more official and stable to users though
23:28 -!- reluc [~rldhont@AMontpellier-553-1-86-2.w86-209.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat]
23:28 < venka> Gerald: we are taking about item b) Jave and Javscript enhancements.
23:28 < djay> he provide documentation embedded in the source code, which I think is the better way to go.
23:28 < djay> he was waiting for some dedicace to himself :)
23:29 < venka> returning to item a) When will 1.2rc1 planned to be released?
23:29 < _maxi> yes, i agrre with Jeff, from my point of view 1.2rc means that it is close to be  officially released the version 1.2
23:30 < djay> for me it is close to be an official release
23:30 < jmckenna> k rc then
23:30 < venka> +1 for rc1
23:30 < jmckenna> +1 rc1
23:30 < djay> +1 for rc1
23:30 < _maxi> so +1 for me too on rc1
23:31 < dkastl> +1
23:31 < venka> motion passed.
23:31 < djay> great
23:31 < venka> item b) Java and Javascript enhancements.
23:32 < venka> djay?
23:32 < djay> I already started branch-1.2 but unfortunately I noticed missing files and thanks to Quang I realize that there was also some trouble with CGAL Services Provider which are now solved in trunk. 
23:32 < djay> yes ok for item b
23:33 < jmckenna> eventually as a project we will need to develop, propose, and document the release process, similar to how MapServer proposed to its PSC (http://mapserver.org/development/rfc/ms-rfc-34.html)
23:33 < venka> djay: We wait for your feedbacks about Java, javascript enhancement.
23:33 < djay> (about missing files, I think that we need at least something like a README file in zoo-kernel/services/api to give some informations on how to setup/use the content of the directory)
23:34 < djay> For Java enhancement, thanks to a work made by Yoshida Daisuke from Tedsukeyama (sure I make mistake in the name) 
23:34 < venka> Tezukayama.
23:35 < djay> thx
23:35 < djay> we activate the JIT (Just In Time) compiler from the Java Virtual Machine which make his code running faster
23:35 < djay> indeed he noticed really bad performances before we made this modification.
23:35 < djay> now his Java Service is running with good performance
23:36 < venka> These enhancements will also be in 1.2rc1, I guess.
23:36 < djay> the really interesting point in the work made by Yoshida-san  is that he made experimentations using ZOO-Kernel and SUN Grid Engine
23:36 < djay> soem mix between ZOO and SUN Grid Engine
23:36 < djay> venka: yes they are in the branch-1.2.
23:37 < venka> (yoshida has his doctoral defense on 18th Feb)
23:37 < djay> I spoke about mixing solutions as SUN Grid Engine is invoked from the Service not from the Kernel itself.
23:37 < venka> Yes, ZOO on SUN-Grid was successfully tested with goGPS WPS.
23:37 < djay> We have to encourage him for his defense
23:38 -!- jgarnett [~jgarnett@27-33-181-124.static.tpgi.com.au] has joined #zoo-project
23:38 < djay> hi jgarnett 
23:38 < jgarnett> yes it is; indeed it is coffee time
23:38 < djay> :)
23:38 < jgarnett> I will be catching up on wps stuff today however
23:39 < dkastl> Just one comment: if we want to call something a RC, then we should be clear about which features should be included and we shouldn't add new ones afterwards. Otherwise there will never be a 1.2 release.
23:39 < jgarnett> how are you
23:39 < venka> item c) openSUSE package available.
23:39 < venka> Hi jgarnett
23:40 -!- jgarnett [~jgarnett@27-33-181-124.static.tpgi.com.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
23:40 < venka> I agree will dkastl comment about releasing 1.2rc1
23:40 < djay> jgarnett: great I'm happy to hear that the WPS Bake Off will go ahead. I feel a bit strange about the non answer to my proposal, I tried to insist on the fact it was just a proposal, I should say pseudo-pseudo-pseudo-proposal maybe :)
23:40  * djay is too slow 
23:40 < venka> Gerald: let us stick to the agenda.
23:41 < _maxi> packaging can greatly help zoo diffusion..
23:41 < djay> yes this is the more difficult for me to stop enhance and add capabilities to the Kernel ...
23:42 < djay> (there was some start of "senv" support -added to the main.cfg maps-  for storing session data and using cookie from the ZOO-Kernel)
23:42 < _maxi> dkast1: +1 for fixing major feature (but minor enhancement could be still possible)
23:43 < dkastl> ... that's why a roadmap is not so bad idea IMO ;-)
23:43 -!- elemoine [~elemoine@AGrenoble-152-1-31-90.w82-122.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat]
23:44 < venka> Draft roadmap already exists. It has to be updated and corrected.
23:45 -!- nbozon [~chatzilla@tok69-7-88-172-227-78.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #zoo-project
23:45 < djay> hi nbozon 
23:45 < venka> http://www.zoo-project.org/trac/wiki/ZOO_RoadMap
23:45 < nbozon> hi all, sorry for being late
23:45 < nbozon> i had pblms with my 3G on my iphone skype
23:45 < nbozon> now i'm at home and can follow up
23:46 < venka> we are at item c) about openSUSE and other distros
23:46 < venka> (we better move ahead with the meeting fast)
23:46 < nbozon> ok thanks vneka
23:47 < nbozon> hi djay, dkastl, jmckenna, venka, i'm here please continue
23:47 < venka> I think other distros will come when 1.2rc1 will be released.
23:47 < dkastl> +1
23:47 < dkastl> not before
23:47 < venka> item d) ZOO API docs
23:47 < djay> yes, about item c, thanks to the work made by Angelos Tzotsos ZOO-Kernel get some opensuse packaging testing 
23:48 < nbozon> yes, that'd be gr8 if others developers try to package kernel for ubuntu/debian, and why not others distros
23:48 < jmckenna> i think gerald covered item d) earlier
23:48 < djay> yes we did 
23:48 < nbozon> sure, we thank him on mailing list, twitter and linkedin group, he made a good job !
23:48 < djay> I think the most important is to cover all the item what ever the order is :]
23:48 < nbozon> what was item d) sorry i cannot remmeber
23:48 < nbozon> ?
23:49 < jmckenna> zoo api docs
23:49 < venka> ZOO-API docs status
23:49 -!- jgarnett [~jgarnett@27-33-181-124.static.tpgi.com.au] has joined #zoo-project
23:49 < nbozon> ok thkx jeff, yes reluc used natural docs, same as OL
23:49 < nbozon> yes still need to improve it, or to port it to sphinx !
23:50 < jmckenna> ah ha! :)
23:50 < venka> We talk about docs in the next agenda item.
23:50 < djay> We go on the item 2) Using Sponsorship fundings  ?
23:50 < nbozon> hi jgarnett, BakeOff is taking shape, sounds good !
23:50 < venka> Item 2) Using Sponsorship fundings
23:50 < djay> a) ZOO@OSGeo Code Sprint (Montreal, CA) 
23:50 < nbozon> ok , let's talk about using fundings ! CS and Docs mainly ?
23:50 < nbozon> yes
23:50 < djay> :)
23:51 < venka> I think the CS funding and docs funding is already approved.
23:51 < nbozon> so djay and i will soon send an email to discuss, for giving our CS 'roadmap'
23:51 < nbozon> and may be call to others ZOO devs to join the CS virtually
23:51 < nbozon> ithink two main points for CS goals
23:52 < nbozon> ZOO-Kernel improv: SOAP/WSDL, #net, ruby supports (for gerald)
23:52 < jmckenna> nbozon: you should also send message to code sprint list letting everyone know you are coming
23:52 < nbozon> ZOO-GRASS demo, Wiki improv (for nick)
23:52 < nbozon> we could may be ask luca and reluc to help on demos
23:52 < venka> Please put all this and update the roadmap http://www.zoo-project.org/trac/wiki/ZOO_RoadMap
23:53 < nbozon> and may be soeren and marco to help on kernel
23:53 < jmckenna> cool, i would be there also and can help test and doc as well :)
23:53 < venka> more demos come after rc1.2 is released.
23:53 < nbozon> venka, i think our schedule willbe set up according to our roadmap
23:53 < nbozon> but yes, may be some items will be added to roadmap, you'r right
23:53 < venka> can we move to item2b) Improve documentation?
23:53 < djay> I think that as dkastl said before a roadmap is important. In trac we can define roadmap, so probably better to write everything there.
23:54 < nbozon> yes, agred, we need to set up dates for the roadmap milestones you've created djay
23:54 < nbozon> yes jeff, i'm getting impatient to join the MTL CS !
23:54 < dkastl> And you need to add tickets for what you will do and assign them to a milestone. Then it will be more transparent to everyone.
23:54 < venka> Gerald, Nick can hack http://www.zoo-project.org/trac/wiki/ZOO_RoadMap and we can make comments on ML or Wiki.
23:55 < djay> dkastl: I agree
23:55 < nbozon> also because snow and poutine can drive me to achieve good work there ! ah
23:55 < nbozon> yes venka, i agrre on this
23:55 -!- kalxas [~kalxas@adsl-136.79.107.88.tellas.gr] has joined #zoo-project
23:55 < jmckenna> re: docs: i made a proposal to improve the existing documentation, move it from trac-based to a Sphinx-based system with easy to read restructured text files that are automatically converted to html and updated on the website, and stored in subversion
23:55 < nbozon> hi kalxas
23:55 < djay> venka: maybe we can use the ZOO_RoadMap for an overview of the roadmap and then point to the milestone on trac, dkastl what do you think ?
23:56 < kalxas> hi nbozon
23:56 < venka> We are in item 2b) Improve docs.
23:56 < kalxas> hi djay
23:56 < djay> kalxas is Angelos Tzotsos we spoke about before
23:56 < djay> hi kalxas 
23:56 < _maxi> hi
23:56 < nbozon> ok, hello, didn't know your irc name angelos, welcome back
23:57 < venka> Great work on openSuse package by kalxas.
23:57 < kalxas> hi everyone, is this a meeting?
23:57 < jmckenna> re: docs: i will also be testing each item as i document it in restructured text, so you all may see many basic questions from me :) but those answers will be used for clear user documentation
23:57 < djay> psc I invite you to thanks him for his work and help on OSGeoLiveDVD testing also 
23:57 < djay> kalxas: yes it is a psc meeting
23:57 < nbozon> yes kalxas, ZOO PSC meeting, but you'r welcome, this is public meeting
23:57 < kalxas> thank you
23:58 < _maxi> so.. 2b) you propose moving from wiki to sphinx..
23:58 < jmckenna> re:docs: and thank you to the PSC for supporting this work
23:58 < djay> back to item b
23:58 < nbozon> so about improving doc, i stil lget one question about linking our Wiki and the upcoming sphinx
23:58 < venka> About documentation. The funding is already approved. So we can move ahead. Only thing we need to think is if Sphinx is the best solution or do it in Wiki and keep things simple.
23:58 < jmckenna> _maxi: yes in fact wiki would still be used for user contributed docs and temp docs
23:58 < djay> jmckenna: I thank you very much for your proposal and you implication in this huge work 
23:58 < nbozon> i understood that sphinx will manage all the doc and that we can mange updates via cron querying the svn, but
23:59 < nbozon> i dont want to loose all the wiki pages we created so far
23:59 < dkastl> Sphinx/rst is simple
23:59 < nbozon> so may be we have to think on how to use Trac and Sphinx side by side in a useful way, jeff ? djay ?
23:59 < _maxi> i'm far away froma sphinx expert, but from my experince it was annoying needing to compile and then out on the server the result before of updating and correcting thinks..
--- Day changed jeu. f?vr. 17 2011
00:00 < jmckenna> nbozon: of course my friend, we will discuss how to use side by side
00:00 < djay> I learnt that a good way to go can be to use Wiki page for temporary/draft content 
00:00 < nbozon> yes dkast, so we nned to make sphinx to trac ? or trac can read rst directly ? do u know ?
00:00 < djay> then once the content passed some approval or was recognize as a good content it can then pass as the sphinx doc
00:00 < dkastl> I don't know about Trac plugins anymore, sorry.
00:00 < jmckenna> _maxi: as opposed to pressing edit, write in wiki syntax, preview, and submit..with no backup or no way to create docs offline?
00:01 < nbozon> my idea is to simplify the wiki pages (keep the most important ones and keep the same method to create/edit pages (like events, general pages, blablaa..)
00:01 < nbozon> and to link to the sphinx pages as much as possible
00:01 < dkastl> with rst docs you can use SVN. You can automatically build documentation in some certain intervals
00:01 < nbozon> should be possible i guess
00:02 < jmckenna> nbozon: sure can be done.
00:02 < nbozon> ok daniel thx for the hint, i wonder how to update both sphinx/rst docs and Trac pages at the same time
00:02 < jmckenna> dkastl: exactly, thats the power
00:02 < djay> I think that all the new or updated frequently content can be stored as wiki page
00:02 < nbozon> yes, i'm pretty sure we can find the best solution soon
00:02 < dkastl> I think officially documentation is something you want to ship with a release, so this is not a Wiki
00:02 < dkastl> or do you want to add TRAC to the relaese
00:03 < jmckenna> wiki page is for temp docs or events or whatever.
00:03 < venka> About docs platform, things should be kept simple enough so that community can contribute in future.
00:03 < dkastl> Trac wiki is for collaborative stuff
00:03 < jmckenna> dkastl: exactly again!
00:03 < djay> dkastl: we don't want to add trac in the package :)
00:03 < nbozon> jeff, docs process can be started on Feb 21st , is it still ok ?
00:03 < djay> dkastl: that is why I think it is really appropriate for ongoing content
00:03 < nbozon> yes, sure we don't want this, vut i think it is bad to kill the wiki, or use it just for tickets
00:03 < jmckenna> since docs will be in subversion they are tagged, treated as releases just like code.
00:03 < djay> but as you said not obvious for documentation
00:03 < jmckenna> docs can be branched, tagged, etc etc
00:04 < nbozon> my idea is more to use sphinks docs, but to include some content into the wiki (from sphinx)
00:04 < nbozon> someting like this
00:04 < dkastl> nobody says kill the wiki. But documentation should be something users can relay on and it should match a certain version
00:04 < nbozon> yes jeff, understood
00:04 < jmckenna> i never said kill the wiki, i said use both: sphinx/rst/svn for official docs,  wiki for user contrib notes/docs, etc etc
00:04 < jmckenna> nbozon: ok cool
00:04 < djay> we are all saying the same thing I think
00:04 < djay> :)
00:04 < dkastl> +1 jeff
00:05 < venka> so any arguments against using Sphinx?
00:05 < _maxi> +1, sphinx + wiki
00:05 < venka> If not we can go ahread.
00:05 < jmckenna> +1, sphinx + wiki
00:05 < djay> +1 sphinx +1 wiki
00:05 < venka> +1, sphinx and wiki.
00:05 < dkastl> +1, sphinx + wiki +1 for going ahead
00:06 < nbozon> +1 sphinx + wiki, awesome material for using ZOO at best, also for beginners
00:06 < djay> dkastl: only for going ahead ? :) ..
00:06 < djay> 3) After 1.2 release 
00:06 < nbozon> ..no, for using ZOO at best, !
00:06 < dkastl> both ... think about a line break in between
00:06 < venka> I propose Gerald as PSC chair take necessary steps to improve docs.
00:06 < nbozon> ah
00:06 < jmckenna> venka: what do you mean by that statement?
00:07 < nbozon> yes, i think we are on the right track for docs, and djay can mange this along with jmckenna
00:07 < djay> jmckenna: I'm not sure also.
00:07 < jmckenna> we take steps as a team as PSC
00:07 < nbozon> and help from others of course
00:07 < venka> Gerald can discuss with Jeff and get the docs moving ahread. that is what I mean.
00:07 < djay> ok, good
00:08 < jmckenna> ok i understand now :)
00:08 < djay> so now next item "After 1.2 release"
00:08 < venka> Also inform PSC when the docs will be ready.
00:08 < nbozon> i agree, now that PSC approved the plan, we need to go ahead, and of course, jeff and djay will handle this like kings (i can help also !)
00:08 < venka> OK for next item.
00:08 < jmckenna> venka: ok sounds good
00:08 < nbozon> ok djay, yes i agrre to move to next item
00:08 < nbozon> i saw the 1.2 brach was created on the svn
00:08 < djay> a)Include some ZOO/GRASS demo on the website 
00:09 < nbozon> yes, i want to do this during CS, may be i call for Markus/luca's help on this !
00:09 < venka> +1 to include ZOO/GRASS demos. they could be added after 1.2rc1 is released.
00:09 < nbozon> mainly for the GRASS commands (WPS queries) i do not know !
00:09 < jmckenna> ah cool
00:09 < nbozon> yes, after the release
00:10 < djay> nbozon: you will be able to use ready to use setup Markus/Soeren/I made on the zoo-project.org server
00:10 < venka> +1 after the release.
00:10 < venka> item b) Include some ZOO/GRASS Services examples
00:10 < nbozon> yes, djay, but what about settinf up params we do not always know, i think their help on IRC canbe gr8 during CS
00:10 < djay> -1 for item b
00:11 < nbozon> like, hey guys, what params do i need for such a GRASS7 module, or something like this
00:11 < nbozon> an dthen we can set up good demos in a easier way
00:11 < djay> nbozon: I thougth you spoke about setup not use sorry.
00:11 < nbozon> djay, you're - 1, you don want GRASS demos to be shown on the website ?
00:12 < nbozon> no pblm djay, misunderstanding for me also
00:12 < djay> I don't think that we have to add the demo GRASS7 services as they are automatically generated and then you can produce them on your own 
00:12 < venka> Nick ZOO demos on website was item a) we have moved to item b) Include some ZOO/GRASS Services examples
00:12 < djay> a page pointing to the documentation provided by Soeren ont the googlecode page of his project can be better I think
00:12 < nbozon> any way, i think we can manga eto set up 2/3 ZOO/GRASS7 demos, to promote our brand new GRASS suport
00:12 < djay> better and enough.
00:13 < nbozon> i am sorry, it's going fast !
00:13 < djay> http://code.google.com/p/wps-grass-bridge/wiki/ZOO_WPS_Integration
00:13 < venka> +1 to point to Soeren's docs for ZOO/GRASS Services examples.
00:13 < nbozon> i'm also -1 to include GRASS services in the trunk, as they are automatically generated by soeren's code
00:13 < djay> this documentation was enough for me to setup the WPS-GRASS-Bridge
00:14 < nbozon> butn i think it'd be gr8 to include the GRASS moduyle list we support on a dedicated wiki page (the "GRASS7 getcapailities")
00:14 < venka> when the examples are tested, we can include them in ZOO official docs too after rc1.2 is released.
00:14 < jmckenna> venka: good plan
00:14 < djay> yes I think this can be huge work 
00:15 < djay> providing documentation for ZOO-Project with GRASS Support is a really great idea !
00:15 < nbozon> yes, ZOO/GRASS service list, + GRASS examples + GRASS demo is a huge work
00:15 < nbozon> but u think very useful for all the GRASS/WPS users
00:15 < nbozon> and so very good for the project
00:16 < djay> we move to the last agenda item ? (almost the last as I would like add a small one at the end)
00:16 < djay> nbozon: I spoke about documentation
00:16 < jmckenna> that bridge will really sell new users to the power of ZOO
00:16 < venka> Will some GRASS examples be included in the ZOO-docs that is coming up?
00:16 < _maxi> yes, but i believe that zoo linked with grass bring the plus it needs..
00:16 < nbozon> yes jmckenna, agreed
00:16 < djay> nbozon: I think we can go until providing a book if we want to give some details, can be really interesting effort.
00:17  * djay is still speaking about doc
00:17 < djay> _maxi: I hope
00:17 < djay> ZOO need more users :)
00:18 < nbozon> yes, sure, but i think this another real documentation work to be done, i think it could be included directly into the sphinx content, if we create the wiki content first for example
00:18 < _maxi> yep, i know
00:18 < djay> maybe the MacOS X installer will help in that 
00:18 < venka> What is the decision on ZOO/GRASS service examples.
00:18 < djay> yo ucan easilly setup ZOO and OGR Base Vect Ops Python based services and use them from the QGIS Client
00:18 < jmckenna> my proposal for docs did not include the massive grass/zoo documentation
00:18 < djay> -1 for ZOO/GRASS Services Examples
00:18 < nbozon> venka, i think only docs and demos needed, exmaples are tough, as the code is genrated automatically
00:19 < djay> +1 for working on proposal for documentation for ZOO+GRASS  
00:19 < jmckenna> +1 well said gerald
00:19 < nbozon> in fact GRASS examples are the officla GRASS7 docs !
00:19 < venka> +1 for examples to come later and for the time to show soeren's page so that users can see examples.
00:19 < nbozon> same commands and params, but inside a ZOO request
00:20 < venka> item c) Preparing 1.3
00:20 < nbozon> so we ould simply list the GRASS? modules we sup?rt, with link to the GRASS docs, for the time being
00:20 -!- Irssi: #zoo-project: Total of 10 nicks [1 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 9 normal]
00:20 < venka> We can discuss after rc1.2 is released
00:20 < nbozon> and yes, im also +1 to wthink and work on a ZOO/GGRASS doc proposal
00:20 < nbozon> yes
00:20 < _maxi> yes, discuss in the future..
00:20 < djay> +1 for discussing after 1.2 is realeased :)
00:20 < _maxi> +1
00:20 < dkastl> +1
00:21  * djay inviting psc to don't quit too fast I still get my last small item
00:21 < nbozon> did we fiw a date for 1.2 official release bfore during this meeting ? (sorry i missed the begining)
00:21 < nbozon> ?
00:21 < nbozon> +1
00:21 < venka> Before the meeting closes I have two important items.
00:21 < djay> great, can I give mine ?
00:21 < nbozon> fix, sorry
00:22 < _maxi> venka, please..
00:22 < nbozon> and djay please, let's go on folks
00:22 < venka> Please check the updated sponsors guidelines pages and comment http://www.zoo-project.org/trac/wiki/Sponsorship
00:22 < djay> I don't know if it is a good sign and I think it is not. Today we are febrary 16th and we didn't get any answer for the ZOO-Project at the FOSS4G. 
00:22 < nbozon> and can someone answer my previous question ?
00:22 < djay> as you know we submited one tutorial and one workshop
00:23 < djay> nevertheless as the answers should arrived today and nothing was in my mail box, I think I wll have to announce a bad new in the upcoming days. 
00:23 < dkastl> It's already 17th in Japan ;-)
00:23 < jmckenna> djay: we are working on announcing, sorry for the delay
00:23 < venka> if the updated page is OK, we can show the sponsorship page more prominently on ZOO web-site instead of the wiki.
00:23 < nbozon> gr8 venka, i see the page was improved, i'll chek right after meeting, thx
00:24 < nbozon> yes, i agree, also we need to add levels in the sponsors div, on the right colum
00:24 < venka> I think all PSC has to check because some changes were made.
00:24 < nbozon> for now i think geolabs, neogeo and oyo are gold sponsors
00:24 < djay> as Gateways and 3liz 
00:24 < nbozon> and then Gateway and 3liz to be bronze sponsors i guess
00:24 < djay> oups sorry.
00:25 < nbozon> or all are gold ? we need to add levels in the sponsors list, no ?
00:25 < djay> jmckenna: nice to hear thatI was a bit afraid
00:25 < _maxi> yes, maybe we can get a vote on PSC list for moving sponsor page on site...
00:25 < nbozon> jmckenna, i understand such task can be delayed !
00:25 < nbozon> a bit !
00:25 < venka> Yes, status of sponsors can be shown on the website. Gerald needs to follow-up with Oyo about how to pay.
00:25 < venka> Oyo does not prefer to use paypal.
00:25 < nbozon> yes, on the way i think$
00:26 < djay> venka: what about Knowledge Partners which are giving money to some sponsor to work on ZOO-Kernel / Service enhancement. I think we have to mention them
00:26 < nbozon> yes, so they can pay the PSC chair directly by bank trnasfer, and he will refunf the Paypal account with this ammount
00:26  * jmckenna thinks good news *could* be coming to zoo and pgrouting foss4g workshop abstract submitters
00:26 < jmckenna> ;)
00:27 < nbozon> wooa, don't make us dream friend ! ah-
00:27 < venka> Jeff: please try to find some sponsors from North America too.
00:27 < djay> venka: you are right Hayashi-san contacted me some days ago about this issue. 
00:27 < nbozon> what kind of sponsors we could grab in the US or Candad, Jeff, any idea ?
00:28 < nbozon> any fuc**** ocessing needs arround you ?
00:28 < djay> I think that we can also search for knowledge sposors which are helping so much the project since the begining.
00:28 < nbozon> processing
00:28 < nbozon> yes, i agree djay
00:28 < jmckenna> non academic you mean?
00:28 < venka> I think Jeff can propose some ideas about getting sponsors from NA on the mailing list.
00:29 < djay> what about inactive PSC member ?
00:29 < nbozon> we said 12 months not being there and they are out right ?
00:29 < venka> Both Sponsors (who pay money) and Knowledge Partners (who ask that researcher and students to work with/on ZOO).
00:29 < jmckenna> north america has same needs for processing as other areas in world, no different.  trick is to have way for users to see the power of zoo...as of yet we don't have that (sorrry if this is strong..but for some reason you are confronting me here)
00:30 < venka> Gerald: Summarize todays meeting and update the meeting page at http://www.zoo-project.org/trac/wiki/PSC/meetings/PSCMeet11
00:30 < djay> nice will do ...
00:30 < nbozon> no pblm jeff, i think with a good doc system, ne impressive demos and updated wiki, you will have som ematerial to convince potentizal sponsors in your area, i hope so
00:31 < jmckenna> offtopic: IBM computers has found that way, attracting users, by having their supercomputer "Watson" take on 2 humans in trivia game ha! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4PSPvHcLnN0
00:31 < jmckenna> :)
00:31 < venka> How do we promote ZOO in NA?
00:31 < jmckenna> create something that we can market
00:32 < jmckenna> how do we promote ZOO in Japan?
00:32 < venka> So that we can attract sponsors in future. I think Jeff has a major role in promoting ZOO in Canada/US.
00:32 < djay> sure
00:32 < nbozon> i think there is already many stuff to promote/sell in evry continent
00:32 < djay> about Jeff promoting ZOO-Kernel
00:32 < jmckenna> create a product, then show it in tradeshows etc.  costs money but that is how products are promoted
00:32 < nbozon> but, we need to improve docs, demos and project 'marketing'
00:33 < djay> as this year FOSS4G is in USA don't you think that Jeff can be easier to listen for an american ?
00:33 < jmckenna> (again that IBM game is an example, imagine the cost to market that!)
00:33 < venka> I think better to have f2f with potential guys in the proximity about ZOO. Jeff is in proximity of places that others cannot visit often.
00:33 < nbozon> yesn, i agree taht Jeff shoudl present ZOO at FOSS4g if we hopefully get one presentation, i think americans can understand you better than gerald and I man !
00:34 < nbozon> what do you think ?
00:34 < kalxas> We (National Technical University of Athens) are very interested in  to become Knowledge Partners. How can we do this?
00:34 < jmckenna> yes i think we need more marketing.  i am interested as to why i am asked about NA market.  i'd ask same for every other market.  we currently have no market plan
00:34 < nbozon> oh, thanks kalxas, it is very simple for this
00:34 < venka> Great kalxas, about knowledge partners.
00:34 < nbozon> knowledeg sponsors are supposed to mpromote ZOO for their reasearch and try to get students usin/improbing ZOO
00:35 < nbozon> that's it !
00:35 < nbozon> sorry for all my typos
00:35 < venka> kalxas: Just send a mail on ZOO-Discuss or ZOO-PSC
00:35 < jmckenna> in MapServer example, this responsibility is placed on the service providers.  eg. Gateway Geomatics is responsible for marketing, and in end helps MapServer grow - Jeff McKenna is not asked to market mapserver by mapserver psc
00:35 < nbozon> zoo-discuss and zoo-psc can be also good
00:36 < venka> Great to end the meeting with a potential new Knowledge Partner and positive outlook for doing more promotions in NA.
00:36 < jmckenna> wow approaching 2 hour meeting!
00:36 < _maxi> friend, I have to leave... is PSC closed?
00:36 < djay> I agree with jeff about promotion on each market and I go at to lower  level to say that ZOO-Project also have to be promoted in france for instance which is not fully the case finally
00:36 < nbozon> ok jeff i get your point hrer, but if you help MS t ogrow via marketing, i guess it's also helping companies around MS like yours or others ? Am I wrong ,
00:36 < venka> Jeff, Mapserver and ZOO are different.
00:37 < djay> I think that the psc is closed, for those which want to continue please continue, _maxi I think you can leave
00:37 < djay> _maxi: many thanks for your time
00:37 < jmckenna> not at all different.  they are at different stages of development yes
00:37 < nbozon> yes, venka, +1 to say taht ZOO and MS are different, the Gran' father and the young Son, talking about longevity and experience !
00:38 < nbozon> iyes jeff, different developemnet stage
00:38 < nbozon> but both from C tribe, good friends so..
00:38 < nbozon> ah-
00:38 < venka> What I mean to say that if you have a chance to personally meet people like Helena, Scott etc, push them to take a deeper look at ZOO. These are potential people who could be attract to ZOO through f2f. Everything does not work on IRC/ML/Wiki.
00:38 < venka> bye
00:38 < djay> I'm not sure venka spoke only about maturity right ?
00:38 < jmckenna> so it sounds like we need to develop a marketing plan for ZOO i assume?
00:38 < _maxi> my last 2 cents: what is the market aim? let people install their zoo? or let people use zoo service?
00:39 < djay> venka: I fully agree on that 
00:39 < jmckenna> ah ok academics.  yes for sure we can plan to push to academics.
00:39 < nbozon> i think both _maxi, but i think we can get a larger audience by letting people use ZOO Services
00:39 < nbozon> with GRASS also
00:39 < nbozon> yes, venka +1 also for networking outside the ML/Wiki too
00:40  * djay is wondering if he can answer _maxi here ...
00:40 < jmckenna> so we need a marketing plan?  why am i being confronted here by name?
00:40 < djay> I agree on f2f meeting and promotion
00:40 < nbozon> a good poitn is taht most of developers asking questions our saying hello on zoo-discuss are willing to install ZOO
00:41 < nbozon> and to potentially use the ZOO servcoes, but may be rather do their own services..
00:41 < nbozon> tricky question _maxi, but a good one
00:42 < djay> willing ... it is the current unfortunate status indeed, I'm not sure this is success :) nbozon, what is your point here ?
00:42 < venka> Motion to close PSC meeting
00:42 < djay> +1 to close PSC meeting 
00:42 < jmckenna> wow interesting ending
00:42 < jmckenna> +1
00:42 < venka> +1
00:42 < dkastl> +1
00:42 < djay> thanks a lot for your time PSC members 
00:42 < _maxi> +1 bye bye
00:42 -!- _maxi [~maxi@host197-38-dynamic.249-95-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit []
00:43 < venka> more on how to attract sponsors on PSC ML.
00:43 < nbozon> djay, i wanted to say that our software is develooper oriented, so people want to install simply (like with the OSx installer) and then use the ZOO services for their nedd, or create their own,
00:43 < venka> bye all
00:43 < nbozon> so diificult to sy if better to focus on isntall/packaging or Services
00:43 < djay> bye venka, nice to talk with you
00:43 < nbozon> bye venka, _maxi
00:43 -!- venka [~chatzilla@i118-18-32-83.s11.a027.ap.plala.or.jp] has left #zoo-project ["I'm not here right now."]
00:43 < nbozon> thx for your time guys
00:43 < djay> nbozon: I think it is indeed a big issue 
00:44 < djay> as Services can be important
00:44 < nbozon> sure it is, we need to yhink more about that
00:44 < djay> this can be included in the roadmap work to be done I think
00:44 < nbozon> yes, this is a good idea
00:44 < djay> or we need multiple roadmaps ...
00:44 < djay> I don't know here honestly
00:44 < djay> dkastl: what do you think ?
00:45 < djay> I think it can be hard to get a roadmap covering both ZOO-Kernel ZOO-API and ZOO-Services so how to handle that ?
00:45 < dkastl> I would make a ticket in track and then assign it to a milestone
00:46 < nbozon> yes, difficult djay
00:46 < nbozon> ok dkastl, djay, jmckenna, if nobody want to add something about meeting, i say bye bye (late here)
00:46 < djay> dkastl: sure but don't you think we can separate zoo-kernel realeases from zoo-services one and zoo-api ones ? I'm not sure 
00:46 < dkastl> make different milestones
00:46 < djay> strange some stuff make me think we have to split some that we don't have ....
00:46 < nbozon> very interesting talk, sorry agai n for joining lately
00:46 < jmckenna> thanks for the discussion everyone.
00:46 < dkastl> ie. 1.2-kernel
00:46 < dkastl> 1.2-services
00:47 < nbozon> yes, jmckenna, talk to you soon
00:47 < dkastl> Have a good night, jeff
00:47 < jmckenna> nbozon: i laughed at your snow and poutine comment! :)
00:47 < djay> thanks for your implication jmckenna 
00:47 < jmckenna> dkastl: thanks, i miss osaka very much
00:47 < nbozon> gr8, i'm willing to have poutine during code sprint, instead of pizza !
00:47 < dkastl> it was snowing here finally a few daus ago
00:47 < dkastl> days
00:48 < djay> dkastl: please send us pictures !
00:48 < jmckenna> ah wonderful, snow in osaka, that sounds beautiful
00:48 < nbozon> $woaa, snow in osaka must be wonderful dkastl !
00:48 < jmckenna> djay: i apologize if i said something wrong
00:48 < nbozon> yes, dkastl, pictures ! you can tag ZOO-Project snow on flickR ! aha
00:49 < dkastl> not sure I made some ... too late now, right?
00:49 < nbozon> btw dkastl, did you attend the Kyoto conference about LBS, GIS and stuff ? was it good ?
00:49 < jmckenna> nbozon: i don't know if the osgeo bike will survive the snow! hahahaa
00:50 < dkastl> there was no conference yet ... it will be in March
00:50 < nbozon> grrr, sur it will not, ege told me that it was rusting this summer
00:50 < nbozon> so snow is gone kill my japanes bike, so sad
00:50 < jmckenna> yes i had many problems with it that last trip
00:50 < nbozon> ah- need to change, next tm ei go to japan -
00:51 < jmckenna> it is not made for my weight! hahahahaha
00:51 < nbozon> yes, rust  weight = dead bike
00:51 < jmckenna> hahhhaahaahahaa
00:51 < nbozon> so you could imagine with snow
00:51 < jmckenna> oops
00:51 < jmckenna> true
00:52 < jmckenna> nbozon: djay what is your arrival/departure days to MTL???
00:53 < jmckenna> i need to buy my plan ticket also
00:53 < nbozon> jmckenna from 14/15 to 21 march
00:53 < jmckenna> wow you stay in MTL that weekend after?!!!!  oh boy, trouble ha
00:54 < djay> :)
00:54 < jmckenna> i was thinking of going to ottawa for that weekend (1 hr 45 min drive) but i can stay with you guys in MTL instead hahaha
00:54 < jmckenna> we can go whatever together
00:54 < djay> It can be a great day I think 
00:54 < jmckenna> yes yes
00:54 < jmckenna> wow
00:55 < jmckenna> that saturday, woot woot!
00:56 < nbozon> yes, jmckenna, +1 to having 3 poutines more with you during week end !!ahaha
00:56 < nbozon> and a lot of fun after CS, i think we'll need it !
00:56 < jmckenna> nbozon: a GetPoutine request each day!
00:56 < nbozon> for ending the MTl ZOO trip
00:56 < djay> +1 to start the week-end on friday 
00:56 < jmckenna> instead of GetKabab!
00:56 < djay> friday evening :)
00:56 < nbozon> sure GetKebad being replace by a GetPoutines !
00:56 < djay> GetKebabilities hahahahaha
00:57 < djay> nbozon: lol
00:57 < jmckenna> i'm laughing out loud guys!
00:57 < nbozon> yes , +1 for friday evening of, and saturday, before we go back
00:57 < kalxas> LOL
00:57 < jmckenna> good times man, oh we have good times
00:57 < jmckenna> +1 djay !
00:57 < djay> please note that I don't know at all montrea, first time for me 
00:57 < nbozon> ouh yess, kalxas, i think you can run GetKebabilities in Greece too ! easier to get those tasty sandich there !
00:58 < nbozon> lol
00:58 < jmckenna> hahahahaha
00:58 < djay> you will have to guide me in the big city 
00:58 < kalxas> GetSouvlaki here
00:58 < jmckenna> we can 'discover' MTL nightlife together
00:58 < nbozon> yes ! so gr8 ! Pitas !
00:58 < kalxas> ;)
00:58 < nbozon> yes i can winman's there also ! aha
00:58 < djay> greece is so great, wonderfull for what I seen of it
00:58 < jmckenna> we will ask 'the godfather'
00:59 < nbozon> yes, this is a beautiful country
00:59 < djay> nice guys, I need guides 
00:59 < nbozon> yo my godfather
00:59 < jmckenna> mmm souvlaki
00:59 < nbozon> yes,and djay, you are our ZOO guide , good to recall this at times also
00:59 < nbozon> so i want to be you MTL guide, along with jeff and god father
00:59 < jmckenna> ZOO Guide :)
00:59 < kalxas> :)
01:00 < jmckenna> oh boy i must rest before that last weekend hahahahahhaa
01:00 < jmckenna> i am sure i will be smoking with you guys that weekend! ha
01:01 < djay> I hope so indeed !
01:01 < jmckenna> you depart MTL airport 21st morning??
01:01 < djay> no it is on the 20 evening I think 
01:02 < jmckenna> oh ok, good to know, i will make sure my flight is similar time to yours
01:02 < jmckenna> what time exactly?
01:02 < jmckenna> not that you guys need help, it will be in your native language! :D
01:03 < jmckenna> but for fun i mean ha
01:03 < nbozon> gr8, jmckenna, nother gr8 osgeo week together, i'm really happy to join, as i've nevr went to osgeos's CS before, Barcelona one's appart
01:03 < djay> mmm
01:03 < djay> we are leaving on 19 ????
01:03 < djay> 19/03/2011 MONTREAL (CANADA)                                 20H25
01:03 < djay> it seems yes :(
01:03 < jmckenna> booo that's saturday!
01:03 < djay> are you sure friday is 20
01:03 < djay> gasp
01:03 < djay> you were wrong guys 
01:03 < nbozon> oh? djay ? i don't think so, i can remeber i read 20 on my eticket
01:03 -!- dkastl [~dkastl@ab144234.dynamic.ppp.asahi-net.or.jp] has left #zoo-project []
01:03 < djay> 19 is saturday !
01:04 < jmckenna> i hope it is 20th.
01:04 < nbozon> ok ok, so it is still cool for friday night and staurday until 16/17h
01:04 < jmckenna> saturday we are full of zoo!
01:04 < nbozon> downtown
01:04 < jmckenna> true true
01:04 < jmckenna> but you will not be sober going to airport on 19th ahahaha
01:05 < nbozon> anyway, good time is coming, jeff i've noticied taht we are quiet a lot to join the CS, more than the prviuos year or not ?
01:05 < djay> nbozon: I come back from dakar on 11 then I go fro m14 to 19 
01:05 < nbozon> no pblm, like to be in planes, or not really
01:05 < nbozon> ah--
01:05 < nbozon> woaaa, tough pllaning djay
01:05 < djay> 19 is saturday, so we get friday+saturday in montreal
01:05 < jmckenna> djay: wow a lot of flying
01:06 < djay> nbozon: the ipad was there or maybe the first day can be even better :) 
01:06 < jmckenna> nbozon: hmm a little quiet.  but maybe your message to that list with wake them up! :)
01:06 < nbozon> europe, america, africa, OUTernational ZOO-Project !
01:06 < jmckenna> MTL girls are amazing.  oh off topic! hahahaha
01:07 < djay> nbozon: I don't go in Dakar for ZOO-Project, but will promote it there for sure ! and will try to meet the OSGeo Senegal Chapter if I get enough time (only 11 days there)
01:07  * nbozon is enjoying this relaxing time on teh ZOO chan !
01:08 < jmckenna> yes sometimes we get too stressed...i need this de-stressing talk here :)
01:08 < nbozon> yes djay, i know you go there for OOc, but yes, another good time to promote ZOO there also
01:08 < djay> as OO is in the ZOO name itself finally :)
01:08 < djay> and I go for OO 
01:08 < djay> oO
01:08 < djay> Oo
01:08 < nbozon> yes, included in ZoO !
01:09 < jmckenna> i will provide a bottle for the ZOO team arrival to MTL :)
01:09 < nbozon> so right, snce the begining
01:09 < nbozon> ok folks, need a break
01:09 < nbozon> talk to you soon, thx for that good meeting and after-meeting
01:10 < nbozon> bye djay, jgarnett, jmckenna, kalxas
01:10 < jmckenna> yes i must run too...i appreciate the good meeting(s) also
01:10 < nbozon> ++
01:10 < djay> nbozon: I need to work :)
01:10 < kalxas> bye nbozon
01:10 < djay> bye nbozon 
01:10 < nbozon> bye
01:10 < jmckenna> bye all, talk soon all!
01:10 -!- nbozon [~chatzilla@tok69-7-88-172-227-78.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86 [Firefox 3.6.13/20101203074432]]
01:10 < djay> bye jmckenna 
01:10 < kalxas> bye jmckenna
01:10 < jmckenna> talk soon you guys
01:11 < kalxas> the GetKebabilities joke is going to be famous here
01:11 < kalxas> :D
01:12 < jmckenna> hahahahahaha
01:13 < djay> came from Barcelona I think
01:14 < djay> or before maybe :)
01:14 < kalxas> :)